Debate - Hide Space

[Linz]

Is it okay if you get to a bird hide super early to take up the space of 3 people with your entire setup?

Or should you, when it gets super full, make some space for other avid bird photographers?


Ok so this is an open debate and all comments and crits are welcome.

[Robbie A]

It comes down to good manners! If the hide is full, move your stuff and let people sit. You do however get some people who are totally self absorbed, selfish and arrogant who will ignore anyone else and use as much space as they feel they are entitled to. The more kit they have, the more they believe that they should be entitled to more space! My 2c.

[visagieh]

And to add, not a proper bird hide, but silence totally ignored. Aka Lake Panic.

[Dodging]

Yeah I was a bit perplexed yesterday. I get myself organised beforehand, so that when I walk in I can just sit down and shoot. All I have is my camera in hand, beanbag and a spare battery in my pocket. Left my bag at home. Everybody around me was unpacking the whole bleeding kitchen sink, making clattering noises, having a chat etc etc etc

[Peter Veitch]

One should be considerate but a 500 f4 on a gimbal head plus tripod does take space and so does one's chair if the benches (wrt Marievale) have found another home. I do find people inconsiderate when they aimlessly stomp around the hide!

If you really want to see people getting peed off, then it's the avid tweeter, the guy with the binocs, note book and reference bird book. They tend to look on us togs as a scurge considering the fact that by and large it was through their efforts that the hides were constructed in the first place.

[Linz]

Robbie - Totally agree
Visagieh - Try the hide at Rietvlei, Marias Dam Picnic Spot - no point after 08h30 - kids running riot too
Dodging - My point exactly! I have my stuff in the boot of my car .... I stop, have a recon, decide what I need and do my setup before entering the hide. Worse is when people leave and you are still shooting, clanging banging and velcro ripping can drive you insane
Peter - By 'your whole setup' I mean more than one, i.e. two camera's, two gimbals mounted on 'planks' and a multitude of lenses.

[SimonDP]

Some people are inconsiderate idiots, some are quite accomodating. There's this thing called etiquette.........and guess what, buying a very expensive SUV/Cruiser and 3 top line bodies with three top lines lenses on each, still doesn't come with free etiquette!

[Nqina Dlamini]

.........and guess what, buying a very expensive SUV/Cruiser and 3 top line bodies with three top lines lenses on each, still doesn't come with free etiquette!

What do mean. I'm now not allowed to show off my expensive toys. Come on have a heart man.

[SimonDP]

You can most certainly show them off, as long as you're very modest about it, and don't take up two parking spaces, and leave room for others in the bird hide.

[Roberto]

Just have a can of baked beans and garlic bread for supper the night before

[Phillip.Grobler]

I have been to marievale twice while hadeda hide was almost full. The first time every one was accomadating and we soon had a space to sit on the far left. but still able to sit. The next time there was only 4 togs but they were a rude bunch and occupied all the benches with gear spreadout. It seemed specifiy to prevent others from sitting down. both times we were only about 5 min behind the first group.

I believe you should make a reasonable attempt to accomedate others.

But you get the same mentality in church on the beach on the road - all the space is mine and dont dare to invade my space.

[elsahoffmann]

Check them out - the rude ones own BWM's (they own a part of the road so part of the hide would be reasonable too)

no good fighting. garlic beans and vrot eggs should make them more accommodating Especially if you politely ask them to stop farting so you can shoot in peace.

[Robbie A]

Check them out - the rude ones own BWM's (they own a part of the road so part of the hide would be reasonable too).

mmmm.. U know about the middle finger don't you!!! lol

As for 4 togs taking up all the benches too prevent others from sitting down... well they rely on you being intimidated by them or by you having manners... well I am not and don't have any in such cases.. I just tell them to move their stuff and make way or else I will move it for them.. they very quickly get the message... and BTW, these are normally those Landcruiser or Range Rover types... the ones that think they know more than me about photography and think that they have a bigger bank balance.. little do they know what us freelancers earn!!! lol

[Nqina Dlamini]

..... little do they know what us freelancers earn!!! lol

Please do tell.
I must confess, I initially misread your post. I read...."little do they know what us freelancers, little we earn".

[Surly Ghillie]

Please do tell.
I read...."little do they know what us freelancers, little we earn".

what's that in English?

these are normally those Landcruiser or Range Rover types... the ones that think they know more than me about photography and think that they have a bigger bank balance..

@Robbie; are you saying the fact of the type of car someone may drive automatically ranks their knowledge of photography below yours? there is no rational correlation to follow.

generalisations are seldom relevent to the issues in any debate. it would not be too different to saying something like" people who harbour feelings of social inferiority usually hide behind large chips that they carry around on their shoulder"

little do they know what us freelancers earn!!!

who cares? BTW, some freelancers earn squat. the degree of financial success or failure than an individual might enjoy has little correlation to their character. rampant egotism is an equal opportunity character flaw. no person or social grouping has a franchise on it . the debate is about selfishness and self-absorbtion in particular reference to the behaviour of individuals in nature hides. in any open society you get countless conflicts between individual value systems. A nature hide is just a microcosm of the broader society. All sense of entitlement sucks ~ irrespective of who is wearing it.

[Dodging]

*finds a dictionary*

[Linz]

On a lighter note ....

Thanks to everyone who contributed.

I was hoping to get opinion from both sides. But so far it seems fairly one sided.

Dear Hide Hogger
I applaud you for getting up at 4 in the morning and 'trekking' out to your destination. I have tried that but failed dismally. Maybe your dedication to your 'craft' should earn you the space of three people.

This is why I started this debate ....

So where are you .... hide hoggers .... state your case!

[Big W]

Dear "Avid bird photographers"

Get your own hide

http://www.stealth-gear.com/products...phy-hides.html

Only joking!

[Nqina Dlamini]

what's that in English?

You are taking this way too serious.

[Forgiss - Sean Nel]

It's sorry that these things happen... It is, quite frankly, not just bird hides... movie theaters, airplanes, everywhere space is at a premium.

I think there are basic ethics and manners on both sides of the coin. I have gotten to places hours before, to get a good space and set myself up for an event or a shoot, and then a guy wil come in at the last moment and just "insert" himself or herself pushing people and their kit aside... that I consider rude - just as much as the guys that do not at least make an effort to keep their "stuff" contained and give space to others.

Sometimes its ignorance, and a kind word will sort out all the problems. This weekend I parked my car at an event, and the guy next to me very kindly pointed out that they have an 'unspoken' viewing line at that venue (completely unmarked and I honestly had no way to know) He was polite and I immediately moved my car behind the 'line' the fret, no fuss... I just didn't know. After all, we are all there to have a nice day?